InformationWeek

March 22, 1999

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The Microsoft Middle-Man (A talk with Chili!Soft CEO Charles Crystle)

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IZONE: IT staffing shortages are still a serious problem. But ASP has some advantages in that area since it is easy to use compared with Java and C++. Has it been a big selling point?

Crystle: Yes. There's the software and hardware problem, but there's also the people issue. There is a shortage of skilled workers, and ASP offers a platform that doesn't require the same skill level as the C++ and Java workers. You can have your highly skilled workers doing the business logic, but then have less-skilled workers putting the pieces together using ASP. This advantage is pretty obvious to IT managers in terms of development time, finding resources to staff the project, and getting it out the door. Companies are paying good salaries for Java and C++ developers but retention is still a problem--there's still a lot of jumping around, especially in New York City and the Bay Area. One of the challenges IT managers face is making development choices that are staffable--they can choose the Netscape Application Server, for example, but they can't use their Visual Basic programmers. They might be excluding 60% to 70% of their developer base. Having a larger pool of developers cuts down recruiting, retention, and HR costs associated with development.

IZONE: What about companies that have already chosen an application server platform?

Crystle: Our goal is to increase ASP's presence, not just under NT as the native application server, but also as the de facto interface for all Web applications. We're moving ASP on top of other application servers, so if you have a high-end application server that you like, chances are we will interface directly with it. So not just the highly trained developers can work in that context, but also the rest of the developers can as well. You get the ease of use of ASP on the front end. ... By the end of the second quarter, we'll be plugged into other application servers as the easy-to-use accessibility layer. So you have, say, Oracle Application Server on the back end, and Chili!Soft ASP patched into that, taking advantage of the service it has to offer. We're working with Oracle on that. They have lots of installations.

There are too many walls between platforms and developer skill sets. We give an IT manager the ability to take a wide range of skill sets and apply them to the same projects. It's exponentially more powerful then when you have to partition the skill sets by technology or platform.

IZONE: Developers who I know complain about ASP's procedural development style--the mixture of scripting and HTML (semantics and content) on a page runs counter to their object-oriented programming style.

Crystle: ASP is very procedural. But it's entirely appropriate because Visual Basic programmers are also very procedural and VB is a very procedural language. Object-oriented development is the kind of development that requires very skilled developers, typically people who are very good with multiple threads of logic--other people aren't as good at that but they can still be productive. For Visual Basic developers, ASP is an entirely appropriate framework. If you want to encapsulate your logic in C++ or Java, your program will perform a lot better, and you'll get code reuse. You can get that with ASP--but you won't have the same degree with 1,000 lines of script as opposed to 30 lines of script and well-constructed server objects. In any case, the next version of ASP will allow you to call out to ASP pages that encapsulate specific functions, but you'll still be embedding variables with the HTML.

IZONE: Still, the idea of developing under NT and deploying on Solaris is compelling to lots of Microsoft shops?

Crystle: We've just done a large deal with an investment bank that uses a ton of ASP on NT, but they've standardized on Solaris on the back end. They wanted to take control of these applications. We've done well in such environments where there has been a lot of unmanaged development on NT with ASP, and then they standardize on Solaris as the back end.

IZONE: Do you feel beholden to Microsoft? Do they really control your business plan?

Crystle: People ask us that all the time: Do you serve Bill? Scott? No, we serve the customer.

NT 4.0 is not scalable. NT 5.0's release is slipping. A lot of IT departments are basing their deployment plans on NT 5.0 shipping on time. It's not going to ship. Maybe it will ship a year from now--maybe a year and a half. You can't build your business on that. They were expecting that this year would be the debug year for the release version, and maybe by 2001-2002 they could deploy with confidence. Now that's not going to happen until 2002-2003. IT departments need a deployment environment and the reality is that tons of developers are building ASP apps.

IZONE: Will you go back to music?

Crystle: I only left the industry, I never left the music. I'm based in Seattle now. I'm just not playing out much now. Last year, I carried my guitar and did open mikes across the country and that was pretty cool. But we're closing our last round of financing now. It's easy to be distracted by that.

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