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Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
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Faye Kane, homeless brain
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Faye Kane, homeless brain,
User Rank: Strategist
2/26/2013 | 12:36:27 PM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
==--
> Win8RT is a way for those who want to simply start fresh with the new paradigm

"New paradigm" = remove even more features from windows.

"New paradigm" = pull the rug out from under the users, arrogantly assuming you can do anything you want to us because of vendor lock-in.

Ballmer = flying your company into the ground, shill. And all your hoo-hah, gung-ho propaganda won't keep the titanic from sinking.

Drown,

-faye
Mike Owens
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Mike Owens,
User Rank: Apprentice
2/21/2013 | 8:19:24 PM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
Many comment on the difficulty or worthlessness of the new Windows 8 GUI. These are most likely the same people that would have cried foul when Microsoft introduced Windows 95 which was a vast improvement over Windows 3.1. Windows XP further updated the GUI, but the majority of changes were elsewhere, as with Windows 7. Microsoft has advanced the OS each time both in terms of GUI as well as underlying ability and security. Each time users have had to learn something new. And with each there have been annoyances, both minor and major, depending on any particular users tastes.

Further, most people making comments base their views on their own preferences. While this is natural it doesn't necessarily prove anything, other than the poster believes something or doesn't. This is especially obvious when facts are either misrepresented or simply blatantly wrong. For example, KitechSang's point of MS killing the PC is based on inexpensive upgrades which Microsoft ended on January 31. Low price upgrades for several months is hardly worth saying that Microsoft is killing the PC industry. Microsoft is in fact doing everything they can think of to keep the PC industry alive, not that it's really going anywhere any time soon. It's not even in decline, per se, as the article mentions the "floundering PC industry". It's GROWTH is in decline, but that's not the same thing. Yes, global sales are a small percentage less than the previous year (3-6% depending on the source) which does point out a fundamental shift in the end use of devices. But it doesn't require overly dramatic descriptions to convey this.

Personally I really like Windows 8 as well as Windows Phone 8. I've used Windows Phone since it first came out in 2010. I now have my desktop and two laptops running Windows 8. The uselessness of the touch screen is highly debatable. I have a Logitech T650 touchpad for my desktop, which I find I rarely even need to use. Keyboard and trackball more than suffice, even when dealing in the interface formerly officially known as Metro but which will probably keep that moniker due to media usage. The Metro UI can very effectively replace the start screen, and it's actually faster to find and run apps if you're not afraid of using the keyboard. If you have a touch screen then with a little learning that is also really easy to use. I can only wonder if those that complain just don't take the time to learn or simply don't wish to.

Of course, everyone is entitled to their own opinion.I truly like the Windows "ecosystem", which I believe is hardly an "Apple-like" ecosystem. And while this article does make some valid points, overall I believe it takes the short term progress instead of looking at the long term, which is undoubtedly what Microsoft is doing. I'm sure Microsoft would be totally ecstatic if all sales of Windows 8 and Windows 8 devices blew past everyone's expectations. But simply put, that's not necessary. Microsoft is creating an environment that simply doesn't exist anywhere else. Time will tell if they're right, but I think they're headed in the right direction.
pbug
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pbug,
User Rank: Strategist
2/21/2013 | 4:15:51 AM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
I imagine that their sales numbers are based on wholesale sales - not end user sales.
pbug
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pbug,
User Rank: Strategist
2/21/2013 | 4:14:53 AM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
I have a friend who bought a new Win 8 PC from Dell by phone. The sales person neglected to tell him (and he didn't know) that the new GUI is next to useless with a touch screen, and completely useless without one. Unlike me he's no geek, and he is struggling to use the PC after many years of Win 95, 98, XP and Win 7 (note no mention of Win ME or Vista). I've tested it fairly heavily; sure, you can install fixes to make it usable, but it is the worst GUI I've ever seen short of the more recent UBUNTU gui's. On top of that, no professional in their right mind would push a business to migrate to it.

IF, and ONLY IF, MS backs off and adds an easy to access setting to let people default to the Win 7 style GUI, I'd upgrade overnight, because the underlying OS does have improvements. However, last summer, I heard from MS (possibly from a now departed exec) that MS planned to block any attempts by users to install things like Start 8 or Classic Shell. Hopefully they've backed off, and who knows, maybe sanity may reign again.
moarsauce123
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moarsauce123,
User Rank: Ninja
2/20/2013 | 12:56:34 PM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
150% increase when 1 is the base is not that impressive in the end. Rather than reporting meaningless percentages we need hard numbers, meaning copies or phones sold to end-users, not licenses created or items placed on order by manufacturers.
Anyone can claim a 10,000% increase over last year where they sold nothing and still sell nothing.
KitechSang
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KitechSang,
User Rank: Apprentice
2/20/2013 | 3:58:07 AM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
Microsoft is killing the PC industry, most folks simply not buying new PCs because MS made upgrading Windows cheap! In the past you buy $500 PC or laptop that comes with Windows because it cost $150+ for Windows upgrade. Now Windows upgrade is $30-70 only!! So many people just buy the upgrade and re-use that PC that came with Windows XP.

Well played Microsoft!
Mark532010
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Mark532010,
User Rank: Strategist
2/19/2013 | 10:31:54 PM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
I struggle with this. I really like Windows, I think its better than the alternatives. I personally don't have too much trouble with the start screen, and I think it could be a boon if there were more options for it...some kind of management ability. Case in point, when I recently installed a desktop utility, it added 17 tiles to my start-screen - readme's, faq's, uninstallers, safe-modes, etc. and the one tile I wanted. You might argue that is the apps fault, but you can't fix everything else, you can only fix your own product. A well managed start screen can be useful for novice users and experts but the amount of effort to keep it up is currently more work than it is worth.

The biggest problem with win8 that I see is the lack of decent metro apps. I am confident Microsoft has had over a year to work on them and who knows how long they have been working with their partners and there isn't one must-have app that would make people switch. The mail app is poor, the video app is poor, the blog posting app is poor, the music app is poor, the printer app is...nonexistent, etc. Even the 3rd party apps like Netflix have poor metro versions. (try to see your dvd queue in the metro version.) If Microsoft and key partners had come out with a suite of killer apps things might have been different, but highlighting things like "fruit ninja" and "cut the rope" during rollout just tells me the new environment is for toys and casual users and anyone wanting to do any serious work should stick to win7 and the desktop.

I keep telling myself that start-screen/metro is a 1.0 release and things will get better but I hope Microsoft doesn't lose sight of people who want to get something done in their race for an integrated ecosystem.
DDURBIN1
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DDURBIN1,
User Rank: Ninja
2/19/2013 | 8:28:03 PM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
Office for Android is not going to happen for at least another year or longer. Once Office runs on Android, why buy a Win8 device? Eventually Microsoft's greed will win out and be released.

Android apps immulated on Win8 will push even more customers away from Win8Phones because of the poor performance and glitches.

Comparing MS's advantage over BlackBerry is like comparing JCP's advantage over Sears, its one looser over another looser.

Win8 Phones are actually quite good phones but the problem is the past 10 WinPhone products that were total disasters. MS has used up all its good will.

If MS put the start button back in the Win8 Desktop, upgrades would fly off the shelvies but expect Ballmer's hard headedness to continue as the point of removing it to begin with is to constantly force metro with the Window Store into every user's face.

ePractical
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ePractical,
User Rank: Apprentice
2/19/2013 | 7:38:32 PM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
Thanks, Good Article.

I think that the elephant in the room though is that Microsoft is getting little or NO Upgrade licenses because Windows 8 not only offers no benefit to regular Keyboard and Mice type computers with no touch capability, but is actually it is a detriment (or plainly said a pain in the butt) for regular clam shells and Desktops. Windows 7 when introduced got plenty of upgrade business.

I am in the Technology Services business and I am getting startlingly more and more people wanting to revert back to Windows 7. I am able to persuade many to keep Windows 8 by installing "Start 8" which restores the Desktop Start button, nested programs and immediate Global Search, and sane shut down.

Also I am perhaps a great example of the Microsoft Win 8 license problem. I have 5 promos for Windows 8 upgrade Licenses at $14.95 since I bought 5 computers during the promo. I bought one and installed it sucessfully on a T61 Lenovo. I don't want the rest. Microsoft keeps sending emails saying "Windows 8 is here - What are you waiting for? Silly them -- you can't simply reply to these emails. If I could, I'd tell them -- I don't want Windows 8 for my clamshell notebooks and Desktops - Windows 7 interface is FAR BETTER for most computers out there now!

If Microsoft wants to sell A LOT of UPGRADEs - quit playing around and UN-HIDE the Star Menu on the Desktop. The faster boot, if nothing else, would be worth the upgrade.
AustinIT
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AustinIT,
User Rank: Apprentice
2/19/2013 | 7:33:54 PM
re: Windows 8: Microsoft's Progress Debated
Would Microsoft like for Windows 8 and the other parts of the related ecosystem to hit it out of the park? Sure. But, the fact is, this new platform is a transition from the old paradigm to the new one. It will take time to make this transition.

MS has a long history of keeping support going for their legacy products. Win8 represents a way to bridge the divide between legacy apps and the new model based on the cloud and mobile. Apple is beginning to find out what that means. Android doesn't care. It's a throw away ecosystem.

Win8RT is a way for those who want to simply start fresh with the new paradigm to get rolling.

As such, I don't expect them to knock Android and iOS off the shelf overnight. And, I fail to see how all of the blustering by the press and the analysts does anyone any favors by trying to convince whoever will listen that MS is failing. Because, they're not... plain and simple.

btw - it would be a tragic mistake for MS to put Office on iOS or Android. Don't do it.
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