Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic? - InformationWeek
Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
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Faye Kane, homeless brain
Faye Kane, homeless brain,
User Rank: Strategist
12/5/2012 | 6:22:33 AM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
Sorry, Redmond shill, that jes' don't feed the bulldog. -

Do I really need to point out that interfaces moved FROM keyboards TO intuitive devices like GUIs and mice? -That's with good reason. - The ultimate in usability will be when the CPU reads your silent commands-via brainwaves. The ultimate in the other direction is instructing the PC in binary code entered with switches, like with my long-dead friend, the PDP-11. That's the direction MS thinks it can herd us into going by paying you guys to insult us on forums like this one.

> "If you use your computer heavily for work or are an IT pro, you should hardly need to use the Start button."

Surely you jest! Everyone, everywhere uses the start button! That's how windows was designed. Just who are you trying to fool, anyway? This isn't Fox News; smart people read Infoworld.

> "Are you all too lazy to learn something new?

That's what every one of you shill posters asks. You expect us to ask that question to our angry users?

Yeah, we'll learn something new if it's better, like multi-touch on tablets. But we're not going to return to the old, clumsy, pre-mouse interface we used 30 years ago in Word Perfect (Shift-F7 to print) just to protect Ballmer from being fired.

> "Microsoft can't sit back and just wait on enterprise to support it"

That's good, because they'll be sitting WAY back and wait a LONG time for IT managers to force this Metro scam on our innocent flocks!

"Since enterprise Windows ops are our prisoners, the *hell* with what they want! Let's tear basic usability features out of the O/S and make I.T. kiss off a hundred grand for touch monitors and half that again to retrain the users for absolutely no reason. That way, when they want a tablet or a telephone, they'll buy the same interface!"

Ballmer reeeeally screwed up this time, and when the board wises up and listens to the shareholders, he's not going to get a chance to repeat it with his next disastrous decision.

-- faye
User Rank: Apprentice
12/2/2012 | 9:15:09 AM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
I don't see the point of Metro.
I don't like ANY of the smart phone interfaces, and I certainly don't want that garbage on my desktop.
There should be a OFF FOREVER button or a patch to KILL METRO!

I just want to get to my applications with the least possible interference.
I want my applications to run WITHOUT interference from the OS.
I still use XP at home, on my 14 machine network. I do tri boot my own machine with XP/Vista and W7. W8 on my i7 16GB testbed machine sucks.
I was a beta tester for everything from W95 through Vista.
I quit the Vista beta shortly before release because MS wasn't listening to the many testers who said...don't do's garbage. I think the results have borne out that opinion.
W7 seems to be what Vista should have been, but years late.
What kind of Moron decided this W8 interface should be a giant step backwards.
Did you use Tabworks with W 3.1? Metro looks like a badly updated version...
From what I have seen of W8 so far, I think it's as bad or worse than Vista.
User Rank: Apprentice
12/1/2012 | 7:49:07 PM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
The article and comments are amusing and entertaining. I don't think the actual market is in upgrades. As hardware improves, the operating system must be improved. And there are many, many new users (first time users) buying the currently available hardware with preinstalled operating systems. These users are learning OS for the first time. And many are already familiar with the iPads and Smartphones, so their learning curve will not be as steep as that for someone upgrading.

I'm retired now, so I don't have to be efficient in my use of time. And I am more concerned about cost of things. If I have an older system with a Microsoft OS installed, I can upgrade to Windows 8 Pro for $39.99. Way to go.

So I dug out a dual core laptop I had laying around, put in a new hard drive, and started to install a legitimate copy of Vista Business 64 bit. This was on a Dell Inspirion. It took me three days to get it running. Problem is you forget things. Where do you look for the specs on a system? Go to Dell, put in the Service Tag number and go from there. Except the service tag number is on the bottom of the laptop so you have to turn it upside down and get a magnifying glass to read it. Another problem is that you can't connect to the Internet without installing the network drivers first. So you need another system and a USB memory stick. Enter the tag, get the configuration information, select the drivers, save them to the USB device, then transfer them to the installing PC and run them.

However, other than general titles, it wasn't clear which drivers I needed since the configuration data was neither accurate nor clear.

So I copied them all and tried to install them all. It took a while.

Then (a bit too late), it occurred to me to look at the BIOS set up screen. The Service Tag number was right there on the top. And much of the installed hardware was listed. Too bad I didn't think of that first. But to get that far, my eyes had to be good and finger fast. The first time, as it flashes by, you see that F2 is required. Then cycle through restarts trying to hit F2 fast enough. Ah, for the good old days.

You would think the detail data would be in Device Manager but it isn't.

Then the problem of running the driver install exe files. Unpacking, creating new directories, storing, and then running setups. Of course they don't all apply and they don't always run the first time. You can't simply point to a driver directory through Device Manager and expect it to work.

And you are continuously restarting so that the drivers "stick". More amusement. Finally, believing all installed, I can verify through Device Manager that I have no yellow exclamation points. Hurray!

Some of the drivers or applications don't work because the system doesn't have the required environment (which you can't get until you have connectivity).

Finally. Oh, but wait. We have to get authenticated. I was lucky with this one, still had the DVD in the envelope with it's product ID on it. That is not always the case. I wish I had a clean Code Generator just to cover the software I already own. I've started a database to record the product IDs when the software arrives. If on DVD or CD, I write the code on the disk using a silver indelible ink pen. I'm not the most organized person.

Now, automatic updates. I click to get the Dell updates, but that takes me to the Microsoft updates. It runs a while and then presents over 100 required updates. Wow.

So they run and the system recycles a few times.

Is that it?

No, now that the first wave of updates is complete, I get another list of more that 100 updates of the updated files. Etc.

And now that I have it set up, I am very reluctant to buy and upgrade to Windows 8.

What we need is an AI program that can run on a system, identify all the hardware or merely test the hardware to determine interface requirements and then create appropriate drivers for each device. Sort of the way universal remote controllers are supposed to work, but never do. Maybe then I'd be able to use the unusual items I bought for earlier systems where the manufacturers went out of business and therefore current drivers are not available.

And all the while, my wife is yelling at me about playing on my computer all the time.

Now I have to find out if I can set up a dual boot so I can buy the $39.99 upgrade and not lose all the effort I just went through.
User Rank: Ninja
12/1/2012 | 12:11:45 AM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
Metro is just a horrible UI. It looks as if a dog ate a box of crayons and barfed them all up again, plus the utterly annoying and permanently changing live tiles. Metro can be used to induce seizures at best, but as a UI it looks butt ugly and is totally dysfunctional.
User Rank: Strategist
11/30/2012 | 1:05:35 PM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
It's Twilight Time,.... for x86 and for Windows
User Rank: Apprentice
11/29/2012 | 10:47:00 PM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
I agree that it's too soon to get out the casket and shovel, but things don't look good for the crtitical holiday season.

To me part of the problem is that Microsoft has deservedly gained a reputation for making gratuitous changes to the user interface at the expense of tightening up what's under the hood, the thinking apparently being that these superficially dramatic changes will make the often expensive upgrade feel important.

That's not what happens from my point of view. I resent that Microsoft creates unncessarily steep learning curve. I'm a technologist but the PC technology is not an end in itself; it's a tool for doing my other work. I need it to be invisible. I'm still mastering rarely used features of Office 2010 and Windows 7 that I knew cold in older versions going back a decade. How is that helpful?

After suffering through several iterations of this behavior it's not surprising that users are skeptical. To me it's conceivable that Microsoft may need to offer a "classic" environment, even if it's only the option to completely turn off Metro on desktop/tablet at install time. Or, because Metro truly is clever and cunning rather than superficially different, it may catch on. Time will tell.
User Rank: Strategist
11/29/2012 | 5:41:09 PM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
Licenses sold do NOT equate to installations. My company owns about 100 Vista licenses, but we've never installed even one - its all about the downgrade rights.
User Rank: Apprentice
11/29/2012 | 1:13:02 PM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
If 40 million in sales (not installed, but on the books for MS financially) in one month is fizzling, how many million in sales is just doing OK?
User Rank: Apprentice
11/28/2012 | 7:38:58 PM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
It started with downloading the 32bit version where I wanted the 64bit! Thanks MS. @#$@#$. Then once loaded I end up spending a lost of TIME downloading 3rd party apps which CHANGE the Win 8 metro into a Win 7 desktop. The ONLY reason Win 8 is still taking up space on my hard drive is it starts up and shuts down faster, and I like IE10. Otherwise it is a failure! Save your time and money, wait for another version BUILT for the DESKTOP!!!
Reiner K.
Reiner K.,
User Rank: Apprentice
11/28/2012 | 7:29:35 PM
re: Windows 8 Fizzling, Time For Windows Classic?
My thoughts on Windows 8 4 weeks on the market:

1.Between the time this article was edited and my writing this comment the sales numbers for Windows 8 have been published. With 40 million in the first 4 weeks sales are better than back when Windows 7 was introduced.

2.We all are cautious enough NOT to go for the very first versions of a new MS OS let alone of a rather radically new OS as Windows 8. So who is sincerely surprised that this release is not being blindly run for as with Apple products? While Apple aficionados go and buy just because itGs out on the market MS friends use a reasonable amount of caution. So letGs give it a couple of months and a first service pack and judge the market then.

3.I agree that there is still a way to go before Windows 8 is a smooth product. But is it a shortcoming of the old Windows Explorer desktop not to answer to the same commands as the Metro? Or is it rather a compromise towards the Gǣold schoolGǥ windows fans to offer a GǣClassicGǥ alternative? The usage is so different that it will take a while for some of us to handle it with ease. But all of us discussing here in this thread are IT savvy, people. Go and ask the Gǣnot so savvyGǥ crowds out there, to them the button "Make everything on your screen bigger." Should do precisely that. Asking them numerous details as to how and what is just confusing them. Their response always will be Gǣwhat part of "Make everything on your screen bigger." Did you not getGǥ.

So what IGm trying to say is G there is really something new here from a user experience, and it will take some time for us to get familiar with, but we all will be surprised how much faster the brought masses of home users will jump on it once they Gǣget the hang of itGǥ. Windows 8 (using Metro) is a great new opportunity for consumers.
I admit that I am somewhat more cautious about my success predictions in corporate environments.
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